you either explode the deficit. raise the middle class tax cuts, something has to give. >> something has to give and we just heard mike say that maybe the thing that gives is mortgage interest deductions. the single most important thing to middle class american families. and that's going to be and we'll get to this later. that's going to be a challenge for paul ryan. i think that what we have experiencing right now and we just said it, is that this sort of style over substance is, is, i don't think going to overtake this race. i think you have a president who was trying to move the facts out. was facing a guy who, who he hadn't seen before. either mitt romney is completely faking everything he said, or he is, is a liar. so -- either way. >> when you see the style over substance, it shouldn't matter. the truth is optics are important. >> look, style -- >> ask richard nixon, the president in 1960. >> i do think in fairness, it is fair for the american people, to want to see their president fight for them. and the bara